Questions about a "Dilemma" and Free Agent Superstar "Football Czars"

by Cleveland Frowns on December 18, 2009

Given that the Browns have offered Mike Holmgren an obscene amount of money to fill a position where he’s never had any substantial success, and that nobody else wants to pay him as much (anything?) to do anything as much fun, it seems inevitable that Holmgren will accept a job as head of football operations for the Browns.  WKNR’s Tony Rizzo said today that it will be announced on Monday.

I’ve tried to explain a bit about why I’d feel a lot better about Holmgren if the Browns leave Eric Mangini in place as head coach, and that such a result seems at least plausible, if not likely, despite media reports to the contrary. Along these lines, I have another question, which is, when has it ever worked?  When has the high-profile GM/’czar’-type free agent signing ever worked?  As far as we know, Bill Parcells’ tenure with the Dolphins is the only potential example, and his Dolphins not only haven’t broken ranks with the slightly-above-mediocre, but their chances of doing so look to be on the rocks.

So why do people always say, like they’ve said throughout the season, and like the OBR’s Fred Greetham said again today:

When Savage was fired, the move to get a ‘czar’ or GM should have been made first before hiring a coach. However, since it was done the other way, the Browns and Randy Lerner are faced with the dilemma they have now.

Does anyone else wonder why this has to be a “dilemma”? Why can’t the team hire a coach who can work with Eric Mangini?  Why can’t Mike Holmgren work with Eric Mangini?  Why would it have to be any different from, say, this, for example:

When Belichick accepted the Patriots’ head coaching position in 2000, Pioli joined Belichick and the two eventually became the first personnel director/head coach tandem in league annals to win three Super Bowls during a four-year span (2001–2004). He and Belichick split the duties usually held by a general manager on most other NFL teams, though Belichick had the final say.

Does anyone think that Pioli ever had much power, much less unilateral power, to fire Belichick?

Even Mike Lombardi agrees that “the game must be run through the head coach’s chair:

The hardest element of being in the front office, with or without all the power, is understanding that the game must run through the head coach’s chair. No matter how much power Holmgren might gain from his meeting with Browns owner Randy Lerner, the head coach must have substantial authority over the roster or the players won’t respond. Players must think they work for the head coach, and as we’ve seen in Dallas, Washington and Oakland, when they think they work for solely for the owner, there’s a disconnect.

So again, we already have a coach. So again: Why do we want to fire a young, hungry and well-trained first-year head coach who, after a painful but necessary housecleaning process, appears to have affected a turnaround in which his team most recently turned in the most effective AFC North-style smashmouth performance that Cleveland has seen in a decade?

And all of this for a guy who by all accounts is not wanted back in Seattle, who’s never had any success as head of football operations anywhere else,* to bring in a new coach to implement a “West Coast” style in the smashmouth AFC North, at the very same time that current Seattle Seahawks head coach Jim Mora is making news for telling his own team, the team that Holmgren built, that it’s known around the league as being “soft”?

Holmgren’s track record in hiring head coaches is non-existent.  And we should be happy to have him run a guy who might be an excellent head coach to bring in an unknown entity for what?

To reach back to his Bill Walsh/West Coast family tree for his coach, seeking someone who shares the same philosophies, terminology, vernacular and football ideology.”

Terminology? Vernacular? Why again do football philosophies have to be so unchangeable and incompatible?

Also, who’s the great new coach from this “West Coast family tree,” anyway? Or are we going to make one up? To keep it in the family?

Until someone can come up with good answers to at least some of these serious questions, I’ll continue to hope that the line that Holmgren won’t work with Mangini is as mangled as so many others about the coach, and that Mangini and Holmgren will end up working together after all.

———-

*From Cliff Olson of NorthwestFootball.Net (which looks to be Seattle’s version of The OBR) (h/t Malcolm Mathers):

Holmgren drafted 38 players during his GM years, with 6 first round picks. Of those 38 players, only 5 became consistent productive starters . . . . It would appear that the Seahawks produced a total of 8 productive draft picks (players making a significant contribution for their team, for a significant period of time), during the four years in question. . . .

Holmgren’s tenure as Seahawks GM was very forgettable. Maybe he could point to the flawed relationship between himself and Whitsitt during his years as GM. Whatever the reason, he was removed from his GM position because he did not get the job done during the four years he had his shot. No doubt that another team will give him the reigns of an organization again. I seriously doubt that the outcome will be any different than his time as GM with the Seahawks. Mike Holmgren’s over-loyalty to certain coaches and players, his inability to properly evaluate talent, and his stubbornness will lead – in my estimation – to another failed GM tenure.

Read the whole thing.

 

  • Cleveland Frowns

    It's the Mizzark, chill in the pizzark, I gotta break, cause momma said be home by dizzark.

    It's a really good video.

  • Biki

    Holmgren doesn't know how to hire coaches? andy reid, jon gruden, mariucci, ray rhodes, mike sherman, morningweg..

    I think Mike Sherman might get some looks as Holmgren's GM.. he had some success up there in GB as the dual HC/GM

  • Pittsburgh is for Man Lovers

    It's beautiful. Re:Holmgren – never trust a big butt and a smile. Or something.

    Candy Girl – one of the greatest R&B songs ever, in my opinion. New Edition > Jackson 5 in my book.

  • smittypop2

    …I can see it now. It is week 17 and the Browns have just finished off the 2-14 sesason and the Browns are having the press conference announcing Mangina will not be back. Frownie (whatever did happen to the Iraqi Information Minister??) will have like 9 posts up talking about how awesome Mangini did and how he is helping him work on his resume. I am really excited for that day my friends. It will be something to behold for the ages!

  • Biki

    what is your beef with holmgren anyway? is it because it is now inevitable that Mangini is 1 and done?? i mean i think we all can agree that the Browns needed to hire a President of the team since Randy is so disconnected and seemingly incapable of doing so. So why not hire Holmgren for that role??? His resume and body of work speaks for itself and his extensive knowledge of being a part of winning traditions in 3 different franchises should be a positive for us.

    but if not holmgren, who do you want as the President? you seem to knock him, but don't have any other suggestions other than let Mangini keep doing his thing.

  • Cleveland Frowns

    My suggestion is don't make a GM or "czar" a superstar position. Get someone in here that will work with the coach. It's all about the coach.

  • Chris

    I'm ok with Holmgren being hired, I just really have apprehension about him actually being the GM of this football team. I think this team could do a lot worse than Sherman.

    Let's give Holmgren some credit, I believe that he understands that the fabled "West Coast Offense" will not work in the AFC North. At least I hope he does.

    Furthermore, Ray Rhodes and Marty Mornhinweg can hardly be considered successful. We're talking about the same Rhodes who is now an assistant defensive backs coach after holding a head coaching job and the same Marty Mornhinweg who decided to kick the ball off in overtime?

  • smittypop2

    Frowns,

    Your excuse this whole season was that Mangina didn't have any talent to work with…now you say it is all about the coach. I would love for you to clarify this comment. I am led to believe (by your comments) that the roster can be picked by anyone and the coach will make it happen.

  • Cleveland Frowns

    The coach needs to have word on what kind of talent he needs to run his system. Mangini has hardly had time to get his guys in place since running the jerks out.

  • Biki

    ray rhodes and morninweg are not successful? maybe not in their initial stints as head coaches, but morningweg is the OC for the best offense in the NFL. and has had great success as a coordinator of the West Coast offense.

    Ray Rhodes is also a very good defensive coach.. he has taken a lighter career path as of late due to a stroke he had..

    but i don't think you get to be the NFL Coach of the Year for nothing (1995)

  • smittypop2

    Why even have a GM then? Just let Mangini continue on as the coach/GM. He is obviously terrible at both.

  • Coachie

    Like you've said many times, Frownie, bad organizations start at the top, isn't it just like an inept owner to leap at the "name" hire?

    Scene: Old Trafford, Manchester, England.
    Randy Lerner is comfy in a luxury suite, wrapped up in a claret-and-blue scarf, sipping earl grey tea and nibbling on cucumber sandwiches.
    On the field before him, his Aston Villa side is busy holding on to its 1-0 lead over Man United, a win that will catapult them into the top reaches of the Premier League.
    Lerner has only one eye on the game, the other is on his Kindle, as he pretends to be enraptured by "Brideshead Revisted."
    Suddenly his iphone rings with an incoming text.
    He announces "Oh my, that's my mobile!" hoping someone will overhear him use the european word for cell phone.
    "Hlmgrn avble, $$$$ rquird, cll asap!!!!" reads the frantic text.
    Lerner's eyebrows arch.
    "Ring my solicitor…post haste!!!" he commands…………

  • CleveBalla

    Yo dat foo man lover aint stayin on his grind playa. Rule numba 1 stay on the grind in yo day. yall gots to be crazy if yall callin dat coach mangina. Dis aint his real name dawg it mangini gets dat right.

    yous have a good end da week an' stay on dat grind and away from dem crazy bitches!.!.

    M.O.B.

  • Cleveland Frowns

    "obviously terrible at both."

    Ray Rhodes.

    Marty Morninwheg.

    Wow.

    Thank G*d for Coachie.

  • Cleveland Frowns

    You too, Balla. Sorry.

  • CleveBalla

    Yo frowns you off your grind today to playa. You fo'got dat he was coach of da year dawg. Come on now get real and get back on da grind. doin big thangs dis weekend downtown yo beastin dem streets boi.

  • Cleveland Frowns

    Who was coach of the year?

    and where at downtown, balla?

  • CleveBalla

    Yo Hustlin' down fo da cavs game tonite. eventually make ma way down to w.6. where da true playas ball. Holla!

  • Biki

    Ray Rhodes was COY in 1995.. but why the focus on Rhodes and Morninwheg? Grooming Andy Reid alone is pretty damn impressive, not to mention Gruden.

  • Chris

    I only brought up Rhodes and Marty Mornhinweg because you mentioned them. I know it was a while ago, but I still find it difficult to believe that someone would actually opt to kick the ball off in overtime.

  • Cleveland Frowns

    Balla: Party in tremont. Hit me up on the email.

    Hey, does anybody know who this "Peter Bell" guy is?

    We think we like.

    http://connect.cleveland.com/user/peterbell/index.html

  • Cleveland Frowns

    Balla: Special Cavs preview coming up for you here. You're gonna like it.

  • Chris

    FYI, Holmgren is on KJR 950 in Seattle talking about the Browns right now

  • Pittsburgh is for Man Lovers

    How am I a fool balla? I've never said Mangini was Mangina. Where you coppin yo sources son? I got nothin but love for ya.

  • Lee Edge

    As you might guess, I agree fully with Frowns on the "no football czar" point. And this was a great post. Sorry to be a day behind. I took a look at that footnote, and the article and I have to say that the guy's "analysis" is unreliable trash.

    First of all, he doesn't describe his methodology of ranking the teams. Second, any methodology that has the Steelers and Patriots drafts in the 20s during those years is ON ITS FACE omitting something important. The Pats and Steelers teams of the late 90s and 00s were built upon their drafts. I appreciate applying statistical analysis to the NFL, but it has to pass the sniff test and this doesn't. Finally, look at his "key contributors" to the '05 team. The QB, most of the OL (including that dominant L side) and the MVP RB were all acquired by Holmgren or kept by Holmgren from the previous regime. The defense (the weakness of that team) was largely built after him. Holmgren's talent acquisition during his time at GM (including drafting) is very strong.

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